The BAR.

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Originally Posted by iRockstar Canavi

The BAR is now 10 damage at 15 clip, 11 damage in perfect condition.

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It 10 damage in events, but 11 damage in PK areas.

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Originally Posted by Vacci

Trade fees have been reduced from 100 to 20 remember? That was an effect of the complaints of trade fees. Tables drastically reduced scamming, that's why it was kept in place.

With all this backlash I won't be surprised if bar gets buffed again slightly. I'd just be upset if all changes were reverted or the overall change is insignificant because the GA's finally put their foot down on the BAR issue and I don't want to see all this effort wasted.

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Support this 100%.
Well said.

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Originally Posted by XSTARX

It 10 damage in events, but 11 damage in PK areas.

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I believe its 11 damage in perfect condition, but it drops down one point when its not in perfect condition.

@XSTARX10dmg in spar is a good reason to ban it away of events
@irockstar I never got scammed. I was careful enouqh to know the riscos

That's the whole point.
It deals 10 damage in events such as Last Man Standing, Spar Tourney, CTF, Team Spar and so on(for events only).
In perfect condition it's 11(close to m107) and it's extremely a great buff for me. But to you, well that's your own personal problem.

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Originally Posted by XSTARX

That's the whole point.
It deals 10 damage in events such as Last Man Standing, Spar Tourney, CTF, Team Spar and so on(for events only).
In perfect condition it's 11(close to m107) and it's extremely a great buff for me. But to you, well that's your own personal problem.

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This is what ive been trying to say haha.

@XSTARX prepare for faster deaths

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Originally Posted by Vacci

Lower standards you argue? All newer guns are lower standards in my opinion. Guns this spammy like miniguns and gm4s haven't been released before because they used to be seen as too OP. Attempts to balance through nerfs can be seen as raising the standard, aiming for a skill-based game. Not p2w.

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I endorse this. +REP.

The bulk of the guns released in the past year have lowered Era's standards tremendously.
They've consistently lowered the freeze on the guns they're releasing, and therefore lowered the skill requirement to use these guns.

If somebody knows that their movement will not be impeded by firing a gun, they'll take less care of their shots, and therefore never recognize the importance of skill; as they won't need it under such circumstances.

Hence, spammers. They've handed them a gun that says, "That's okay, you don't need to learn to fight. Just spam until your heart's content."

I was beginning to think they were going to continue this whirlwind of self-destruction, until I seen that the BAR was nerfed. It's a beacon of hope that, maybe they're going to start re-assessing the lower standards they've created, and begin moving back towards skill-based gameplay.

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Originally Posted by iRockstar Canavi

Hi all.
Yes you all know about the BAR's attributes being changed by the many threads being made.
The clip size has been reduced by 10 bullets down to 15, whilst the damage has been upped to 11 when in perfect condition. (10 default)
The reload time has been reduced, meaning a faster reload..
If you'd like to ask questions or discuss this topic, please do it here.
Thanks.
No BAR's will be refunded. Period.
(Im sure the description of the weapon will be updated soon.)

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This is the most retarded thing...how about make the damage 10 again and on top of it all why the hell would the reload time be nerfed, this just makes bar even more of a bottom spar spar gun.

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Originally Posted by Bram

@XSTARX prepare for faster deaths

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We will all be killed by BAR users.
Nobody has live on without getting mauled.

imo i like the bar right now. the only

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problem is 15 clip

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probl

It's funny how this was sticky.
First of, people complain that BAR is rig, as I went on Era people said it's OP.
Please make up your minds Graalians...because if you don't, things will be worst.

Edit: Sam said it's a temporary, meaning it's only a test. I don't even want it to end lol...

11 dmg isn't much use. It is no real improvement on 10 because it still takes same amount of shots to kill. That's my opinion on the damage.
Lower clip could be a problem but the faster reload seems to just about make up for that.
I personally don't see what was accomplished by this nerf/buff because overall it is still the same. Don't get me wrong I'm not demanding a refund or saying it is a big nerf but to me it just doesn't appear much different. Whether that's good or bad I don't know.

Anyway that's my thoughts on this.

I gotta hand it to Sam- he's addressing something that every Gun Admin has wanted to address since the BAR was released.
I quote myself,

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Originally Posted by Meph

The issue I encountered as iEra Guns Admin was that the guns that were already released when I came aboard were already too powerful for my liking, and, had real money never been a factor, I would have just done what I did on PC Era and set those powerful guns to make more sense, shortening the gap between the M4-tier and BAR-tier guns.

I run with the philosophy that somebody's wallet should have no bearing on their success in a fight. I always have, and I always will. I have this stance because I worked hard to get good at PKing-- in my time, such handicaps weren't available; and I'm glad they weren't. It made for more competitive game play, and gave us all something to shoot for, and the time we invested in reaching that goal prompted us to play longer. People are less inclined to develop this mentality if they have the easy route of just purchasing a gun to do the work for them. Easy come, easy go.

Unfortunately, I couldn't apply the rule to encourage this mentality because, as I said, the bar (no pun intended) was already set. Changing a gun that people spent bookoo bucks on is pure immoral theft. It would be like a McDonalds employee reaching out to your tray and removing a beef patty and bread layer from a Big Mac after you've already purchased it and saying, "Sorry sir, we should have never done this".

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On this note, I'm seeing Sam get verbally attacked at the Spar Complex with people saying he should have "asked the players."

For at least the past two years, the BAR has been receiving negative input from the players- Sam is addressing two years worth of complaints; and giving the players an opportunity to test the changes before made permanent.

The change isn't even something I'd classify as a "Nerf".
Right now it's basically an 11-damage M4.

For the damage it deals, it should be met with at least a 0.35 reload freeze.
But like I said in my earlier post in this thread, this is a step in the right direction.

Skill Based Game > P2W

Don't end up like this guy:
http://puu.sh/a3Ia1/403860de6f.jpg

Hahahaha the mini gun destroys the bar in the PK! It still takes five shots to kill a player, but before the bars outrageous clip was due to the fact that it win in every match up. I've been pking all morning and not a single bar user has taken me down. Only mini gun people.

The fact that people complain how the BAR is ruining the game since 2012 till now, and look at the results.
They are still complaining, they think it's so easy to balance a gun with numbers. Most complainers are usually the ones who packs(no offense) which made Era into a downhill.

Okay the only reason people get mad is because they got killed by a bar
also if this no more gonna be the best gun in era
A other gun is gonna be it
like gm4,p2k,mattlestorm,shipka
It's better we keep it up with the bar.

I don't understand, I mean look at it.
The BAR's reload is back to normal, now it's 11 damage and 15 clip. Can't people just use those 15 clips to base/PK? Is it that important to have 25 so you can spam all the way at the doors. The reload makes up for everything regarding the clip, that is why Sam did it.

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Originally Posted by Bram

Okay the only reason people get mad is because they got killed by a bar
also if this no more gonna be the best gun in era.

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That's the thing, man.
There isn't supposed to be a best gun. You chose guns based on preference.

Under no circumstance should a gun be determined as "the best" by the general public.
The fact that people believe in such a thing is evident that a nerf is in order.

You pay the extra money on the BAR to give yourself an advantage.
Your purchase is not to achieve victory without putting in the effort to learn to fight.

If you want victory, stop hiding behind your wallet and learn to play.

^^^^!!!!!

Anyways the clip seems like a drastic drop, but the reload is almost non existent. Since the reload is so quick it's almost like having a unlimited bullet wall. I'm conflicted I liked my clip size, but I love the reload speed of the short clip.

Wow. Thanks for ruining a gun i paid rl money for *Clap* dumbest thing ever done.

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Originally Posted by Meph

That's the thing, man.
There isn't supposed to be a best gun. You chose guns based on preference.

Under no circumstance should a gun be determined as "the best" by the general public.
The fact that people believe in such a thing is evident that a nerf is in order.

You pay the extra money on the BAR to give yourself an advantage.
Your purchase is not to achieve victory without putting in the effort to learn to fight.

If you want victory, stop hiding behind your wallet and learn to play.

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Explain why there's such gun called the mini then lol.. All it does is spam. Dead, spam, dead,spam,dead. Wow yeah, that's so much worse than bar so go ahead and nerfthe bar, next time you nerf it, make it 1 dmg. Because its already a piece of junk

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Originally Posted by XSTARX

I don't understand, I mean look at it.
The BAR's reload is back to normal, now it's 11 damage and 15 clip. Can't people just use those 15 clips to base/PK? Is it that important to have 25 so you can spam all the way at the doors. The reload makes up for everything regarding the clip, that is why Sam did it.

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No thanks, 11 dmg, 10 dmg, still the same, 5 bullet shot. Just bring it back. Wow

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Originally Posted by AceLion

Explain why there's such gun called the mini then lol.

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I've stated above that I don't endorse the bulk of the gun stats released within the past year.

That includes the Minigun.

Get used to your guns and melee's changing. Graal doesn't make these changes to make players happier, Graal makes the changes to make more money. They can't just keep coming out with better and better weapons so they constantly have to nerf guns to make headroom at the top so there's a new thing to spend gralats on. People who spend real money on guns need to understand this truth. Your guns over time are going to get nerfed. The things you buy with EC are over time going to get nerfed. Just enjoy the fact that for a while you had the "best" gun and know that in the future that "best" gun wont be the "best" and there will be another "best" gun to go out and spend your gralats/money on.

I dont see what people are complaining about if anything the bar got an upgrade.

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Originally Posted by iRockstar Canavi

Hi all.
Yes you all know about the BAR's attributes being changed by the many threads being made.
The clip size has been reduced by 10 bullets down to 15, whilst the damage has been upped to 11 when in perfect condition. (10 default)
The reload time has been reduced, meaning a faster reload..
If you'd like to ask questions or discuss this topic, please do it here.
Thanks.
No BAR's will be refunded. Period.
(Im sure the description of the weapon will be updated soon.)

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ok this is cool and all, and like the update, but id feel happier with the clip being 20. i bought the bar out of pure digging, since im not allowed to buy itunes anymore ;-;. slowly the clip has been getting smaller and smaller, and frankly, a clip of 15 doesnt seam to cut it. im not saying it should go back to 35, but i say, at least keep it no lower than 20.

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Originally Posted by Random22

Get used to your guns and melee's changing. Graal doesn't make these changes to make players happier, Graal makes the changes to make more money.

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Both Gun Admins don't get paid, I don't get your statement.

I don't know why people are unsatisfied with the BAR's change.

The only thing that has been severely changed on it is the Clip Size, but that's been countered with a quicker reload.
While you have to reload more frequently, you're less vulnerable when you have to reload, since the time spent reloading has been cut down 25%.
This means you can get back into the fight faster.

Additionally, they've increased the damage by 1; and while it may not assist you in any more in a 1v1 situation, it benefits you in a raid.

Let's say that you're raiding a base. You have a BAR, and you're with a group of friends who are all using M4s.
All of your guns are in perfect condition.
Let's say they hit the opponent 1 time, and you hit them four times.

• With the old BAR stats, your opponent would still be running around, threatening your team.
• But with the new BAR stats, he's dead, and you guys can shove some hotdogs in your mouth to prepare for the next unsuspecting victim.

And during events, guns are forced to be in 'Good' condition.
This means that the BAR used to be 9 damage; so you had to land 6 hits on your opponent.
But now it deals 10 in such events-- this means you can take an opponent out in 5 hits.

And let's not forget, you're able to reload faster now.

All of this considered, it depends on your angle:
For spammers, the gun has been nerfed. Sorry, your mindless spamming sessions have been cut in half.
For people actually applying technique, the gun has been buffed.

I'm not in the habit of catering to people who disgrace the game by spamming, so I have no sympathy for them.

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Originally Posted by Nyx

Both Gun Admins don't get paid, I don't get your statement.

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He means that people pay rl money to get a good gun faster.

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Originally Posted by iRockstar Canavi

Oh well.

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No, not oh well. Events are a major apart of era, and all pk/spar based events don't deserve to be ruined becuase now the bar is even more OP. The buff -yes I consider it a buff- is not a good idea. The bar was already OP as it was, and now upping the damage and lowering the reload time makes it
More powerful. Yes it takes 5 shots to kill in perfect shape, but in certain circumstances it's just too powerful. Let's say someone has 32 health. Normally the bar does 10 damage. If you were to try to kill the person with 32 health, it would take 4 shots; 3*10=30<Which is less than 32 so it would take another shot 4*10>32 to kill the person. When using the new, 10 damage bar(11 upgraded; for this example I'm implying all guns are in perfect shape, as majority of people upgrade guns) it would take 3 shots to kill the person, as 11*3=33 which is greater than 32. That's a huge advantage. Don't try to retort saying the clip size was reduced and use that fact to say it was a nerf; the higher damage and fSter reload more than makes up for that.

As for what I said about events, the new bar has a huge advantage. In all pk/spar based events, all guns do damage they would normally do in good shape. With that being said, the bar took 6 shots to kill, while most other guns like the m4 or souizen, 8 damage guns, took 7 shots to kill. Yes the bar still had an advantage, but it was a reasonable, well-deserved one, considering it is basically the most expensive gun in the game. Now since the new bar does 10 dmg, it will do, does, 10 damage in events, which means it only takes 5 shots to kill, while like I just said, majority of other guns will take 7 shots to kill, and that's just stupidly unfair and that fact that bitszam had no idea this was even a problem worries me.

This needs to be fixed.

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Originally Posted by Meph

I don't know why people are unsatisfied with the BAR's change.

The only thing that has been severely changed on it is the Clip Size, but that's been countered with a quicker reload.
While you have to reload more frequently, you're less vulnerable when you have to reload, since the time spent reloading has been cut down 25%.
This means you can get back into the fight faster.

Additionally, they've increased the damage by 1; and while it may not assist you in any more in a 1v1 situation, it benefits you in a raid.

Let's say that you're raiding a base. You have a BAR, and you're with a group of friends who are all using M4s.
All of your guns are in perfect condition.
Let's say they hit the opponent 1 time, and you hit them four times.

• With the old BAR stats, your opponent would still be running around, threatening your team.
• But with the new BAR stats, he's dead, and you guys can shove some hotdogs in your mouth to prepare for the next unsuspecting victim.

And during events, guns are forced to be in 'Good' condition.
This means that the BAR used to be 9 damage; so you had to land 6 hits on your opponent.
But now it deals 10 in such events-- this means you can take an opponent out in 5 hits.

And let's not forget, you're able to reload faster now.

All of this considered, it depends on your angle:
For spammers, the gun has been nerfed. Sorry, your mindless spamming sessions have been cut in half.
For people actually applying technique, the gun has been buffed.

I'm not in the habit of catering to people who disgrace the game by spamming, so I have no sympathy for them.

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Yes this is a buff. But buffs aren't necessarily good, let alone called for. The bar was OP as it was, and the stats just shouldn't change, as it is now even more overpowered. It makes me sick.

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Originally Posted by Collin Rosato Magus

No, not oh well. Events are a major apart of era, and all pk/spar based events don't deserve to be ruined becuase now the bar is even more OP. The buff -yes I consider it a buff- is not a good idea. The bar was already OP as it was, and now upping the damage and lowering the reload time makes it
More powerful. Yes it takes 5 shots to kill in perfect shape, but in certain circumstances it's just too powerful. Let's say someone has 32 health. Normally the bar does 10 damage. If you were to try to kill the person with 32 health, it would take 4 shots; 3*10=30<Which is less than 32 so it would take another shot 4*10>32 to kill the person. When using the new, 10 damage bar(11 upgraded; for this example I'm implying all guns are in perfect shape, as majority of people upgrade guns) it would take 3 shots to kill the person, as 11*3=33 which is greater than 32. That's a huge advantage. Don't try to retort saying the clip size was reduced and use that fact to say it was a nerf; the higher damage and fSter reload more than makes up for that.

As for what I said about events, the new bar has a huge advantage. In all pk/spar based events, all guns do damage they would normally do in good shape. With that being said, the bar took 6 shots to kill, while most other guns like the m4 or souizen, 8 damage guns, took 7 shots to kill. Yes the bar still had an advantage, but it was a reasonable, well-deserved one, considering it is basically the most expensive gun in the game. Now since the new bar does 10 dmg, it will do, does, 10 damage in events, which means it only takes 5 shots to kill, while like I just said, majority of other guns will take 7 shots to kill, and that's just stupidly unfair and that fact that bitszam had no idea this was even a problem worries me.

This needs to be fixed.

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Yes this is a buff. But buffs aren't necessarily good, let alone called for. The bar was OP as it was, and the stats just shouldn't change, as it is now even more overpowered. It makes me sick.

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Mate it's a test, stop complaining obviously it isn't intended to be made a buff which was why he decided to test it first, whose to say he won't try some other changes over the next few days because usually a test implies trying a range of different things until you can get a working end result.

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I mean seriously it hasn't even been a day

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Originally Posted by Renegade

Mate it's a test, stop complaining obviously it isn't intended to be made a buff which was why he decided to test it first, whose to say he won't try some other changes over the next few days because usually a test implies trying a range of different things until you can get a working end result.

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I mean seriously it hasn't even been a day

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Lol? I'm aware, thank you. This is a test, and I'm sure they want feedback, so This is my opinion. As you can probably tell, I hate it.

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Originally Posted by Meph

I don't know why people are unsatisfied with the BAR's change.

The only thing that has been severely changed on it is the Clip Size, but that's been countered with a quicker reload.
While you have to reload more frequently, you're less vulnerable when you have to reload, since the time spent reloading has been cut down 25%.
This means you can get back into the fight faster.

Additionally, they've increased the damage by 1; and while it may not assist you in any more in a 1v1 situation, it benefits you in a raid.

Let's say that you're raiding a base. You have a BAR, and you're with a group of friends who are all using M4s.
All of your guns are in perfect condition.
Let's say they hit the opponent 1 time, and you hit them four times.

• With the old BAR stats, your opponent would still be running around, threatening your team.
• But with the new BAR stats, he's dead, and you guys can shove some hotdogs in your mouth to prepare for the next unsuspecting victim.

And during events, guns are forced to be in 'Good' condition.
This means that the BAR used to be 9 damage; so you had to land 6 hits on your opponent.
But now it deals 10 in such events-- this means you can take an opponent out in 5 hits.

And let's not forget, you're able to reload faster now.

All of this considered, it depends on your angle:
For spammers, the gun has been nerfed. Sorry, your mindless spamming sessions have been cut in half.
For people actually applying technique, the gun has been buffed.

I'm not in the habit of catering to people who disgrace the game by spamming, so I have no sympathy for them.

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That ^

There is nothing to be complaining about.
I would be complaining if it was completely removed or the stats of the weapon was dropped down.
As Meph as stated above- there is or shouldn't be any best gun on Era, you should choose your gun based of preference. Not the price.

may pls know why u ruined my favorite gun?! everyone was happy with it but u guys just had to mess it up right? i want a refund on it k? i didnt pay 200k for 15 rounds only. or bring back the old bar the way it was.

Here we go...

I manage to survive with a neo rifle, and it's my best streaking gun, happy?

oh ok and im supposed to care for some reason? i paid 200k gralats for my bar and ur neo rifle costs 4.5k so take a hint, k?

What I'm saying is I didn't need to pay for a good gun.

Anyways I bet the admins are just trying to see what will happen if they nerf the BAR, they'll change it back if everyone asks for a refund.

Was the only change the clip? In WWI and WWII it was manufactured with a clip of 20 rounds.
It's not like it takes 10 seconds to reload.

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Originally Posted by iRockstar Canavi

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That ^

There is nothing to be complaining about.
I would be complaining if it was completely removed or the stats of the weapon was dropped down.
As Meph as stated above- there is or shouldn't be any best gun on Era, you should choose your gun based of preference. Not the price.

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There is plenty to be complaining about.

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Originally Posted by John J

Hahahaha the mini gun destroys the bar in the PK! It still takes five shots to kill a player, but before the bars outrageous clip was due to the fact that it win in every match up. I've been pking all morning and not a single bar user has taken me down. Only mini gun people.

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Haha lies, you never seen me use my bar

The bar is now 17 clip, reduced reload, 10 damage perfect.

that's for a while???